What was your first experience with religion? Did it cause you to cling to Christ. Or did it repel you?
What kind of taste did it leave in your mouth?
Feel free to once again define the difference between the two.
And then:
What was your first experience with relationship? I am talking a relationship where you were truly loved unconditionally, as you are….I mean, you could be the biggest screw up, and all they see is a golden child. They keep on loving. They know you are ok. That you will turn out ok…that all is good.
Keep in mind that I am attempting here to start a dialog amongst us.
So, include as much detail as you want, and please, please, comment to one another.
I have belonged to a religion since birth. I know I relied on the convictions of my parents for a long time just like anything with a parent / child relationship. Association is a huge security blanket. When I left home for college I began to wonder if I truly believed what I have always said I believed in. I began a journey of self discovery and after making A LOT of mistakes, spending time in the refiners fire, and spending A LOT of time on my knees in prayer I came upon my own conversion.
My first relationship that you speak of came shortly after a traumatic childhood experience. An unmarried, beautiful, sunday school teacher taught my class. I KNEW she loved me. I know the Lord sent her to me when I needed to feel His love. The love you speak of; unconditional, unwavering. I felt His love through her.
You ask to define the difference between the two and in my opinion religion is like the foundation of a house and what you build upon it is between you and your relationship with God. Everyone can go about it a different way, personal to them and their strengths but must be designed in accordance to that foundation. More specifically someone who practices Judahism will not use the same foundation as a Christian. Now I guess they can change their foundation but that’s another blog.
Not sure if what’s in my head is translating onto the page…happens quite often with me
The earliest I can remember…
-My mom would always tell us when we were naughty, how sad we had made Jesus, and how disappointed he was in us. It didn’t take me long to decide that there was something wrong with me. And for years I carried (still struggle with it) guilt for everything. It didn’t have to have an actual basis… I felt guilty for who I was.
-My parents (especially my father) were very legalistic. They changed a lot in my adult years as they learned about grace, but growing up in a legalistic home drove me away. They were also extremely protective, and I chafed at the restrictions.
When I was 17 and went off to college, I remember saying to myself, “I cannot keep all these rules. I cannot be perfect. I cannot be who they want me to be.” I decided I hated Christians, I hated church, and I had no intentions of playing that game anymore. So I rebelled big time. I did everything I’d never been allowed to. But, interestingly enough, I never denied Christ. I knew God was there. I didn’t doubt that. But I gave up on the ‘religion.’
When I was dating my husband I talked to him about God (in the bar where we had met, one night after a few pitchers), and he ended up getting saved some months later, which brought me back to God. Right back into some legalism for awhile until that came crashing down around our ears, but then we started to work on the relationship.
I don’t know if I’ve ever had that relationship you are talking about with someone. My husband perhaps is the only person in my life who has ever come close to loving me for who I am.
My introduction was mixed, religion and relationship.
The folks in charge of guiding me to growth always told me that I would be punished by God.
Punished for being a boy with an active imagination.
When I asked about God I was told he was my father.
Why then would he bring such harm to his child.
I chose to seek a very personal relationship with God, and the way I see him is, He expects me to make mistakes, and he wants me to learn from them.
There is enough pain on the journey without God having to punish me for being human.
Adam
TRN~
“I chose to seek a very personal relationship with God, and the way I see him is, He expects me to make mistakes, and he wants me to learn from them.
There is enough pain on the journey without God having to punish me for being human.”
so.so.so very true.
Jac
I love how you articulate your thoughts. You are really good at it.
I really appreciated what you shared here.
I’ve never thought of it that way.
thank you….
love
Storie
HW, our stories sound so similar…
I can totally relate.
I am thankful that God gave you the gift of your husband.
wow…
Hey, Storie! I’ve been thinking about this for a couple of hours. Reading through the other stories I would say mine is most similar to Heidi’s in that I knew I was always making Jesus sad and the legalism was too hard to keep. But I tried. I tried so hard and I kept trying…and kept adding more rules…until I became burned out from trying so hard.
My husband was the first person I knew who loved me unconditionally. I still don’t understand his grace toward me, it’s a bit overwhelming sometimes. I think he just doesn’t have high enough expectations…?
I believe Jesus loves me unconditionally. My mind and heart tell me this is Truth. I don’t always remember though. The burden of legalism, perfectionism, performance-oriented upbringing weighs heavy. It’s not from Him, I know. It’s from a wrong teaching, a wrong theology that has been ingrained and has become almost instinctual. I spend much time in His Word to replace the lie with the truth.
“What was your first experience with religion? Did it cause you to cling to Christ. Or did it repel you? What kind of taste did it leave in your mouth?”
My VERY first experience with relationship took place at a Roman Catholic Church when I was a boy. The priest was actually a very pleasant man. And all these years alter, I can still see his smile. When I had my first communion at that church, I was taught that I had a Creator who loved me dearly, loved all the animals too, and loved the entire Earth and the stars very much. It was quite an experience to a child who gazed upon sunsets with such awe and wonder.
My VERY first experience with religion actually took place shortly after I had got saved, eight years after my first communion (my parents had divorced by that time and they had both stopped going to church). But the church I had attended as a teenager was fundamentalist. So I was taught that good people went to this church and bad people didn’t, but it was our mission and our purpose to get them to come to this church. It was quite a contradiction–because I was also taught that I would never stop sinning this side of eternity. So that made me a bad person, which meant that I had to hide my sins and my problems.
And I don’t do that anymore. I don’t boast about my sins, to be sure, but I do discuss my problems and my struggles openly. And I try to understand why I do the things I do that I shouldn’t do. I also make a very strong effort to understand that about others as well.
Heidi said, “My husband perhaps is the only person in my life who has ever come close to loving me for who I am…” And that is certainly the way it should be in a marriage, but it seems you are still learning the difference between your legalistic upbringing and who God really is. I know I’ve had my share of struggles with that, and I was so glad to let it go. When I was in college, I started backsliding, too–though for very different reasons, probably. And when this prodigal son had returned Home, he went right back to the same church. And had the same problems. But since I didn’t want to give up on God, I found another church. Very laid back. Now if I can just make it there on Sunday mornings in the summertime…
Michelle said: “I spend much time in His Word to replace the lie with the truth…”
I spend more time praying, asking for His help, than I do reading. I should spend more time reading–instead of commenting on all these blogs–but…my point is, I once had the same problem Michelle did, though to a much lesser extent. Long story short…My most common prayer is, “Help…”
And that is enough for me. (Especially since most of the time I can’t even begin to grasp the whole thing.)
hi everyone,
I have been reading each of your entries, thank you, and it has stirred up a question in me.
So how do you raise your kids loving Jesus(relationship), loving people with grace and not in legalism (driving them away from God)?
How do you teach them in a practical everyday way? I have 3 girls.
I would love some wisdom and insight in this. Thank you so much!
Pearl, this has been my goal, to do it different for my kids than was done for me. I’ve come to the conclusion that they must see it modeled. If the love I have for Jesus is full to overflowing and the grace He’s given me, I pass on to them, they get it. How does that live out practically? I smile LOTS (believe it or not, NorEaster
) and speak firmly. They know God loves them because I tell them constantly and when they fail I do not, I WILL not berate them, as was done to me. I listen to their hearts and hurt with them when they hurt. I give biblical counsel but not in an angry fashion.
I’m not perfect, by any stretch of the imagination, but all my kids love the Lord and have been gracious toward others as they witness for Him. They have stumbled, we all do. One has made grievous, life-altering choices but he quickly turned back to the Lord and has chosen to live with the consequences of his sin through the Spirit’s help. I think that’s the best we can hope for…not perfection, but a desire to live for God and not self.
This is a very interesting discussion. Thank you, Storie for bringing this subject up and encouraging dialogue.
I was brought up without religious training whatsoever. I did have an Aunt who attempted to answer my questions like, “Where did God come from?” And I had a friend at the age of six that told me that if I didn’t give my life to Jesus I was going to go to hell. “Giving my life” meant walking down the center aisle in a Baptist Church and telling a man in a long black robe with huge sleeves that I wanted to accept Jesus. That alone scared the hell out of me! Since that experience I’ve gone in many different directions in my life, most of them trying to please myself. I still have not reached any definite conclusions about religion vs. relationship. But this is what I do know…I agree with Jacque that religion is a foundation. It gives us a place, a context in which to stand. There are some things, if you are a Christian that must be “legalistic” in order to call ourselves Christians. One of those things is believeing that God gave His Son Jesus as a sacrafice for our sins and that Jesus Christ proved He had power over our sin by rising again from the dead. This is the beginning of a relationship, when I receive what God has to offer. The Bible sets a standard, as well as giving us the materials to build with but I need help to actually build. I can’t do it by myself. This is where the Holy Spirit and the Christian community come in. We need each other. So, I’ve come to understand that I will never live a perfect Christian life and God is not even interested in that. He wants me to know Him, put Him first, love Him most and be involved in my daily life. That takes time and is a lot more risky, but much more satisfying, than trying to do all the right things. There is one more component in all this that my Aunt so wisely pointed out, the way many of my questions were answered by her, “There are some things we cannot know because it’s a mystery.” I want to thank everyone for sharing their comments. You’ve given me much to think about.
To Pearl I would say that loving your children, accepting them for who they are and setting an example for them by how you live your life is the most powerful way to tell them how to have a relationship with Jesus. But I would also add that there are no formulas…again it’s all about relationship!
An Addendum – The forgiveness and acceptance God offers me must also be given by me to others. Am I talking too much?
“The forgiveness and acceptance God offers me must also be given by me to others. Am I talking too much?”
When you say that…NO.
Debra~
Never! You talk all you want here…..you add so much!
love you!
Nor~
you are such an encourager.
I love that!
Well…I’m not the only one, you know.
Nor,
no, but you are pretty consistently that, around here!
I appreciate the bread you bring to the table
Michelle,
Check your email.:-)
I so appreciate you….
love!
S
Debra,
mom….I love this story.
I did not have time to respond to you earlier…so I sent you a quick email…and then, of course we talked, as usual, tonight.
Thank you so much for sharing your heart here.
I so appreciate you. I wish the world knew you. You have so much to teach all of us!
My favorite part of this story:
you go to church to get saved from “hell”, and then get the hell scared out of you!!
I laughed so hard. Even though I have heard this story before….
YOU are my inspiration mom
I love you SO SO SO SO much.
Storie
PS
sleep well…..
wish I was there.
I miss you so much:-(
Pearl,
I miss you! Even though we spent 3 hours together today.:-)
My advice to you is to keep doing what you are doing.
It is hard to see the fruit when you are in the thicket.
You are one of the most amazing people I have ever met. You are whole hearted, diligent, caring, compassionate, alive, engaged, honest, full of integrity, and HUMBLE to boot!
This world needs more “pearls” like you.
You are an incredible inspiration to me.
and I know that I am not the only one.
my love
Storie
first taste of religion? elementary school. my grandparents church. very regimented and unnatural. awkward.
relationship? God. He accepted me from the first moment i called on Him. no strings. still blows my mind. then, earthly relationship? brent. my earth angel. another mind blower. so undeserving – yet HE continues to bless!
Michelle, Thank you so much!!! Your wisdom truly blessed me and helped me in a practical way. I love what you said:
” If the love I have for Jesus is full to overflowing and the grace He’s given me, I pass on to them, they get it.”
“I smile LOTS and speak firmly.”
“I listen to their hearts and hurts with them when they hurt. I give biblical counsel but not in an angry fashion.” Thank you again!!!!!
Debra, Thank you for your wisdom too! I love what you said:
“accepting them for who they are and setting an example for them by how you live your life is the most powerful way to tell them how to have a relationship with Jesus.” I love that!!! thank you!!
Storie, my precious friend, Thank you for reminding me i am still in the thicket of things. and encouraging me to continue to press on! I love you!!
P.S. Michelle, Debra and Storie- Is there a book you would recommend for me? thank you again to you!!!